Comments on: The Central Problem Of Missional http://jonathanbrink.com/2009/12/02/the-central-problem-of-missional/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=the-central-problem-of-missional Business Development & Communications Tue, 15 May 2012 08:11:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Howard Pepper http://jonathanbrink.com/2009/12/02/the-central-problem-of-missional/#comment-3758 Howard Pepper Sun, 17 Apr 2011 07:19:00 +0000 http://jonathanbrink.com/?p=186#comment-3758 My first 45 years were spent in a good variety of Evangelical churches, and included some conservative ones within Lutheran (Missouri Synod), United Methodist and Episcopal. That included ministering (professionally and volunteer) in many of them. I slowly and purposefully left the "fold" entirely around then, 16 years ago, so I don't much concern myself with "missional" issues within that worldview/theology. I'm more Process now, if anything Christian other than a follower of the ethical/compassionate/general spiritual teachings of Jesus. But I like to keep connected a bit and contribute where I can (I have many family members and friends still Evangelicals, even missionaries).nnSo I will add that my sense from that varied but fairly uniform background and a Biola U., Talbot Seminary education was the central problem was the fall... and resulting "original sin." Thus, the need to be reconciled with God to repair the separation which we were puzzlingly both not responsible for AND responsible for. And this definitely focused mainly on the individual, not on society or the Church, etc. My first 45 years were spent in a good variety of Evangelical churches, and included some conservative ones within Lutheran (Missouri Synod), United Methodist and Episcopal. That included ministering (professionally and volunteer) in many of them. I slowly and purposefully left the “fold” entirely around then, 16 years ago, so I don’t much concern myself with “missional” issues within that worldview/theology. I’m more Process now, if anything Christian other than a follower of the ethical/compassionate/general spiritual teachings of Jesus. But I like to keep connected a bit and contribute where I can (I have many family members and friends still Evangelicals, even missionaries).nnSo I will add that my sense from that varied but fairly uniform background and a Biola U., Talbot Seminary education was the central problem was the fall… and resulting “original sin.” Thus, the need to be reconciled with God to repair the separation which we were puzzlingly both not responsible for AND responsible for. And this definitely focused mainly on the individual, not on society or the Church, etc.

]]> By: jshmueller http://jonathanbrink.com/2009/12/02/the-central-problem-of-missional/#comment-2018 jshmueller Tue, 08 Dec 2009 19:50:00 +0000 http://jonathanbrink.com/?p=186#comment-2018 My best guess would be that "first" in this case means "of first importance and therefore first in the decalogue", not first in the temporal order. The Genesis reference is about the first temptation in that realm, not about a commandment addressing it. In other words: the temptation to play God was clearly there before the first of the ten commandments addressed it explicitly.rnrnIn my view, it's not the conscious and deliberate disobedience regarding God's will and law that is the heart of the problem but the buying into an alternative story that promises us a better and more glorious outcome than the one God is inviting us into. My best guess would be that “first” in this case means “of first importance and therefore first in the decalogue”, not first in the temporal order. The Genesis reference is about the first temptation in that realm, not about a commandment addressing it. In other words: the temptation to play God was clearly there before the first of the ten commandments addressed it explicitly.rnrnIn my view, it’s not the conscious and deliberate disobedience regarding God’s will and law that is the heart of the problem but the buying into an alternative story that promises us a better and more glorious outcome than the one God is inviting us into.

]]> By: jshmueller http://jonathanbrink.com/2009/12/02/the-central-problem-of-missional/#comment-423 jshmueller Tue, 08 Dec 2009 17:50:22 +0000 http://jonathanbrink.com/?p=186#comment-423 My best guess would be that "first" in this case means "of first importance and therefore first in the decalogue", not first in the temporal order. The Genesis reference is about the first temptation in that realm, not about a commandment addressing it. In other words: the temptation to play God was clearly there before the first of the ten commandments addressed it explicitly.<br><br>In my view, it's not the conscious and deliberate disobedience regarding God's will and law that is the heart of the problem but the buying into an alternative story that promises us a better and more glorious outcome than the one God is inviting us into. My best guess would be that “first” in this case means “of first importance and therefore first in the decalogue”, not first in the temporal order. The Genesis reference is about the first temptation in that realm, not about a commandment addressing it. In other words: the temptation to play God was clearly there before the first of the ten commandments addressed it explicitly.

In my view, it's not the conscious and deliberate disobedience regarding God's will and law that is the heart of the problem but the buying into an alternative story that promises us a better and more glorious outcome than the one God is inviting us into.

]]> By: jshmueller http://jonathanbrink.com/2009/12/02/the-central-problem-of-missional/#comment-1150 jshmueller Tue, 08 Dec 2009 17:50:22 +0000 http://jonathanbrink.com/?p=186#comment-1150 My best guess would be that "first" in this case means "of first importance and therefore first in the decalogue", not first in the temporal order. The Genesis reference is about the first temptation in that realm, not about a commandment addressing it. In other words: the temptation to play God was clearly there before the first of the ten commandments addressed it explicitly.<br><br>In my view, it's not the conscious and deliberate disobedience regarding God's will and law that is the heart of the problem but the buying into an alternative story that promises us a better and more glorious outcome than the one God is inviting us into. My best guess would be that “first” in this case means “of first importance and therefore first in the decalogue”, not first in the temporal order. The Genesis reference is about the first temptation in that realm, not about a commandment addressing it. In other words: the temptation to play God was clearly there before the first of the ten commandments addressed it explicitly.

In my view, it's not the conscious and deliberate disobedience regarding God's will and law that is the heart of the problem but the buying into an alternative story that promises us a better and more glorious outcome than the one God is inviting us into.

]]> By: Jonathan Brink http://jonathanbrink.com/2009/12/02/the-central-problem-of-missional/#comment-2019 Jonathan Brink Tue, 08 Dec 2009 16:35:00 +0000 http://jonathanbrink.com/?p=186#comment-2019 Sarah, you and I follow similar paths. Sarah, you and I follow similar paths.

]]> By: Jonathan Brink http://jonathanbrink.com/2009/12/02/the-central-problem-of-missional/#comment-2020 Jonathan Brink Tue, 08 Dec 2009 16:35:00 +0000 http://jonathanbrink.com/?p=186#comment-2020 Adam, thanks.nnThis closely aligns to the Evangelical tradition I grew up in. Adam, thanks.nnThis closely aligns to the Evangelical tradition I grew up in.

]]> By: Jonathan Brink http://jonathanbrink.com/2009/12/02/the-central-problem-of-missional/#comment-2021 Jonathan Brink Tue, 08 Dec 2009 16:33:00 +0000 http://jonathanbrink.com/?p=186#comment-2021 Josh, thanks for that. What caught my attention is the line, "violating the first of all divine commandments, 'You shall have no other gods.'" The reference is to Gen 3:5, but the actual verse is in reference to the Ten Commandments. So the first is actually not the first. nnJust wondering why they would say that? Josh, thanks for that. What caught my attention is the line, “violating the first of all divine commandments, ‘You shall have no other gods.’” The reference is to Gen 3:5, but the actual verse is in reference to the Ten Commandments. So the first is actually not the first. nnJust wondering why they would say that?

]]> By: Jonathan Brink http://jonathanbrink.com/2009/12/02/the-central-problem-of-missional/#comment-418 Jonathan Brink Tue, 08 Dec 2009 14:35:49 +0000 http://jonathanbrink.com/?p=186#comment-418 Sarah, you and I follow similar paths. Sarah, you and I follow similar paths.

]]> By: Jonathan Brink http://jonathanbrink.com/2009/12/02/the-central-problem-of-missional/#comment-1154 Jonathan Brink Tue, 08 Dec 2009 14:35:49 +0000 http://jonathanbrink.com/?p=186#comment-1154 Sarah, you and I follow similar paths. Sarah, you and I follow similar paths.

]]> By: Jonathan Brink http://jonathanbrink.com/2009/12/02/the-central-problem-of-missional/#comment-420 Jonathan Brink Tue, 08 Dec 2009 14:35:13 +0000 http://jonathanbrink.com/?p=186#comment-420 Adam, thanks.<br><br>This closely aligns to the Evangelical tradition I grew up in. Adam, thanks.

This closely aligns to the Evangelical tradition I grew up in.

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